Multiple assault objectives

Real time World War II combat simulation
Post Reply
Quitch
Posts: 297
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2004 8:56 am

Multiple assault objectives

Post by Quitch » Sat Jul 16, 2005 9:42 am

How about adding multiple objectives to some missions? Should help cut down on the tank blitz tactic.

User avatar
Tim_Myth
Posts: 28
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2005 12:49 am
Location: Dilworth, MN
Contact:

Post by Tim_Myth » Sun Jul 17, 2005 12:05 pm

That's a good idea, but even with multiple objectives, you would only have to charge one, leave a tank or two on it and then charge the other one with your remaining tanks. In some missions it is possible to have 9 Panzer II's.

I think some different missions would help. There was another thread talking about some. I think I'll find it and bump it.
By Request DJ & Karaoke Company - Yesterday's Traditions, Tomorrow's Technology.

User avatar
Tim_Myth
Posts: 28
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2005 12:49 am
Location: Dilworth, MN
Contact:

Post by Tim_Myth » Sun Jul 17, 2005 12:56 pm

Ah hell, I can't find it, and this topic is much more descriptive so I'll just post some mission ideas in here. Of course, since this is a war game, most of your missions should be simple attack or defend missions, but throwing even a couple of variations in would make the game more interesting. The full German campaign is over 140 missions after all. I think the tank blitz is cheesy, but 80 five minute cheesy blitzes is better than 80 one hour slug fests.

1) Prisoner snatch. You lead a small group of men into the enemy lines to get prisoners for interrogation. This would require a slightly smaller map and heavy use of recon squads. Scenario could contain things like a tank, a HMG, a mortar, or even a FG, but they would be unlikely. A slightly smaller map would probably be good too. Mission ends when you retreat or take X number of prisoners.

2) Rescue. Some friendly troops have been encircled or otherwise trapped behind enemy lines. They are low on ammo and about to be over run. You must resecue them. They would be on the opposite side of the board with enemy troops between you and them. They should not be under your command, and preferrably they should have a command unit that counts as the objective. They will move towards your side of the screen, but since they have little or no ammo, they won't move unless their is a very clear path.

3) Break out. Your men have been encircled and you must make it back to friendly lines. This is really just an assualt, but the name is changed, and the objective is one whole side of the board. You must move all your units to that side of the board, and any units not returned to that side of the board are considered lost. This would be a great mission if you tied campaign battles together because leaving men behind would be very harmful to future battles. You could also weight the probability of this mission showing up to represent players who have over extended themselves. For example, divide my total play time by my number of missions. If I have been doing tank blitzes, my average mission time will probably be less than 10 minutes. This means I have very likely left lots of enemy troops in my rear and run a very big risk of being encircled.

4) Delay. A unit of enemy xxxx's have been sighted moving towards {someplace}. Your mission is to slow or stop their advance. This is a simple defense mission, but there isn't really an objective for you to defend. Instead, the objective is on the left side of the screen, your on the bottom, and the enemy is on the right. It ends when the enemy column has reached it's objective, is completely destroyed, or one side retreats. There could potentially be recon squads acting as picket guards along enemy lines.

5) Destroy a bridge. This mission would be a simple assualt, except the objective is a bridge that must be destroyed by a demo squad. The demo squad could be essentially a recon squad.
By Request DJ & Karaoke Company - Yesterday's Traditions, Tomorrow's Technology.

User avatar
Sean OConnor
Posts: 1299
Joined: Fri Sep 03, 2004 7:47 am
Location: Cambridge, UK
Contact:

Post by Sean OConnor » Sun Jul 17, 2005 2:24 pm

Excellent ideas there! I'll definitely make the next version have more than just "attack" and "defend" so keep the thoughts coming...

User avatar
Legacy
Posts: 664
Joined: Thu Feb 17, 2005 4:34 pm
Location: Wellsboro, PA, USA
Contact:

Post by Legacy » Sun Jul 17, 2005 2:41 pm

I like the rescue and hemmed in concept. Being hemmed in, you should be in a situation where fighting the enemy to the death would overwhelm you.

This may have been mentioned in the past, but having survivors carried on and becoming more battle hardened veterans is really compelling. They would more wisely maneuver and not cower in fear quite so much, and maybe be a bit more accurate...

Quitch
Posts: 297
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2004 8:56 am

Post by Quitch » Sun Jul 17, 2005 5:23 pm

I posted some ideas in this thread: http://www.easymessageboard.com/forums/ ... .php?t=492

Something needs to be done about tank flooding. To my mind the easiest method is carrying your troops from one mission to the next, limiting the money you have and not allowing you to sell existing squads. Then again, I wouldn't consider that satisfactory as it doesn't fix single battles, and I can't stand endless desert campaigns so don't often campaign. I do think you win a bit quick once you have the objective. The enemy should at least get a chance to counter-attack. I'd say at least five minutes, maybe even ten. That'd stop silly artifical wins in positions you could never hold, but you won because the timer said you did.

One way would be to have objectives in more open locations, like on hills, or the AI could be more aware of tank flooding and likely to place anti-tank guns with a view of the objective.

This would give you more reason to keep men alive AND give the retreat function a decent use. Right now there's no reason to run until only your HQ is left.

I'd really like to see joint missions where you and another army (controlled by the AI or networked partner) have to defend against a larger single force. Only half the funds would be yours, and you'd have to try and co-ordinate your actions with those of the AI. I think it would be rather fun :)

Introducing a third force gives you all sorts of possibilities too, like a "defend for X minutes until Y arrives, then drive off the enemy" scenario, and so forth.

Also, to cut back on certain tactics, how about last minute reassignments? You're told you're going to assault X and choose your force, but at the last minute you're reassigned to defending Y as an emergency measure.

User avatar
Fighter_Ace
Posts: 409
Joined: Mon Sep 06, 2004 4:36 am
Location: Sacramento, CA, United States of America - Also can be found somewhere in the land of 1's and 0's
Contact:

Post by Fighter_Ace » Sun Jul 17, 2005 11:44 pm

Another mission could be some kind of building, facility, or certain target destruction on enemy premises. That way, tanks would have to be out of the picture because they would be (1) slow, big, and bulky in enemy areas with lots of defence... bad idea because you are easily caught [Just imagine someone trying to rob a bank with a tank! How about trying to spy? Heck no!] (2) men would be more appropriate for taking out a building, target, recent top-secret enemy plans or discovery.
My thanks and best regards to all my former submitters.

User avatar
qwas
Posts: 350
Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2005 6:00 pm
Location: London, UK
Contact:

Post by qwas » Mon Jul 18, 2005 6:38 am

SPYING MISSIONS, use your troops to locate the enemy plans, then send in the spies and hold off the enemy troops until you have the... ENIGMA MACHINE, or SUPRISE ATTACKS... (Im going crazy, I got 1 trillion ideas which will probably turn Firefight into CM!!)

Anyway, What about, hold off the Germans for XX mins until the XXXXXXXXXXXXXX Construction is built, or more buildings, first ones re-inforce, hold off the Germans till reinforcements arrives.....
Proud member of Seans forum since 14th April 2005. 1 year and still counting.
Now to spam those 30 messages to get into 3rd place in post count. :D

I'd like to buy your soul please.
http://www.mindistortion.net/iwantyours ... lex_Rider2

Quitch
Posts: 297
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2004 8:56 am

Post by Quitch » Mon Jul 18, 2005 9:38 am

Here's another idea, how about fixed placements? In certain defence missions you could have access to things like pillboxes.

Don't know about spying though, this is Firefight after all.

User avatar
Fighter_Ace
Posts: 409
Joined: Mon Sep 06, 2004 4:36 am
Location: Sacramento, CA, United States of America - Also can be found somewhere in the land of 1's and 0's
Contact:

Post by Fighter_Ace » Mon Jul 18, 2005 2:06 pm

Quitch wrote:Here's another idea, how about fixed placements? In certain defence missions you could have access to things like pillboxes.

Don't know about spying though, this is Firefight after all.


Now theres an idea! And maybe some missions could have trenches? Maybe you could attack a prison camp with guard towers? barbed wire?


One thing Id'e LOVE to see are medics. You always have medics in warfare. Remember in the movies when they shout, "Medic!!!" Your medics could heal your wounded men but could also be killed by gunfire. They shouldn't carry any firearm so you'de have to protect them yet aid your men! Man, this is getting good!


And maybe you could tell your men to exit the tank. Sometimes I get so frustrated because a anti-tank gun has locked on to my tank. I would like to be able to evacuate my tank and try to save as many men as possible if I am to lose my tank!

And I know you said you were thinking about this, Sean, but I'de think it would be great to also have half-tracks, etc. instead of just tanks.


One last suggestion... engineers. Yeah, I know what you are thinking, I'm crazy! But think about it first. Imagine being able to slowly repair your tank if you even manage to make it back to your engineers in one piece. Also, engineers could set up temporary shelters. For instance, sand bag fortifications, bunkers, plus many other items! Oh the possibilities!


More units = funner, more advanced, and totally awesome game!
Last edited by Fighter_Ace on Mon Jul 18, 2005 2:46 pm, edited 6 times in total.
My thanks and best regards to all my former submitters.

User avatar
Andy
Posts: 209
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2005 8:42 pm
Location: Edinburgh! (its le balls)

Post by Andy » Mon Jul 18, 2005 2:11 pm

go buy command and conquer


like the pillbox idea, whatabout prepared positions? give men the first few minutes to build dugouts? so you would have to send forward a few men to slow down the advance

also putting civilians into the fray? if you get a reputation for killing them they attack you, refugee lines etc.

ive mentioned it before but ammo trucks/drops, troop trucks/drops, APVs, half tracks, delivering men quicker to vital places, but with the risk of all of them being taken out.
________
girlfriends pics
Last edited by Andy on Sat Feb 05, 2011 1:33 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
qwas
Posts: 350
Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2005 6:00 pm
Location: London, UK
Contact:

Post by qwas » Mon Jul 18, 2005 2:33 pm

Quitch wrote:
Don't know about spying though, this is Firefight after all.



use your troops to locate the enemy plans, then send in the spies and hold off the enemy troops until you have the... ENIGMA MACHINE, or SUPRISE ATTACKS...

It includes troops
Proud member of Seans forum since 14th April 2005. 1 year and still counting.
Now to spam those 30 messages to get into 3rd place in post count. :D

I'd like to buy your soul please.
http://www.mindistortion.net/iwantyours ... lex_Rider2

User avatar
Tim_Myth
Posts: 28
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2005 12:49 am
Location: Dilworth, MN
Contact:

Post by Tim_Myth » Mon Jul 18, 2005 6:10 pm

Yes, but most of our troops should be just basic troops. Nothing so special as a SEAL squad, James Bond, or some other covert type thing. Think of commonly found items/missions. Fire Fight is in between some grand scale strategic conquest game like Axis & Allies and a small scale tactical game like Ghost Recon. The focus of the game should not be on micro-managing men from tree to tree and sniping that lone sentry on the watch tower, nor should the focus be on managing supply routes or planning major offenses through the Ardennes. Aim for something in between where strategy and tactics are an important part, but micro-managing indiviual soldiers and making war influencing decisions isn't.

Besides, it's clear from campaign mode that we will be avoiding all the pivotal events in the war. Missions like blowing up a dam were common enough for the air forces, but rare for ground pounders. For that matter, actual para-drops were not all that common either, so I can see why they aren't part of the game. On the other fox holes and trenches were very common. It was fairly common to take and hold river crossings or major road junctions, but sneeking out at night to cut enemy communication lines was not a task routinely assigned to a green replacement.

The game is good for tactics (although men need to be able to follow a tactical plan like "Don't fire until you see the whites of their eyes" or some such thing), but it is lacking in strategy. For example, in the game, a tank blitz is a great tactic to win the first 80 missions as the Germans. In real life, simply charging your tanks through a dozen countries would leave them surrounded, cut off, and unsupplied so it would be a horrible strategy, but without these consequences in the game there is no reason to play for 100+ hours and hope to get a good rating when you can spend 4 hours blitzing with your tanks and get "Superb" ratings.
By Request DJ & Karaoke Company - Yesterday's Traditions, Tomorrow's Technology.

User avatar
Tim_Myth
Posts: 28
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2005 12:49 am
Location: Dilworth, MN
Contact:

Post by Tim_Myth » Thu Jul 21, 2005 3:17 pm

I just had another thought while I was playing my latest campaign. Wounded troops should have their condition worsen during battle to reflect loss of blood or shock (especially badly wounded men). And for that matter, they could "heal" too to reflect shock from a minor wound wearing off.
By Request DJ & Karaoke Company - Yesterday's Traditions, Tomorrow's Technology.

User avatar
Fighter_Ace
Posts: 409
Joined: Mon Sep 06, 2004 4:36 am
Location: Sacramento, CA, United States of America - Also can be found somewhere in the land of 1's and 0's
Contact:

Post by Fighter_Ace » Thu Jul 21, 2005 6:09 pm

Thats why I said medics would rock! Just read my previous post!
My thanks and best regards to all my former submitters.

Post Reply