Computer can erase barons?

panicboy · Post by **panicboy** » Sun Mar 28, 2010 2:31 pm

The last time I thought I'd found a bug I was proven wrong, so I have some trepidation, but I've seen this many times now.

I'm playing a very hard level, and the I got to the point where it had created a baron (always a last resort!). This is good for me, as you can then use that to your advantage: all its men are tied up in this strength-sapping 54-man behemoth. This is the reason I don't use them myself: you become very inflexible. Anyway I keep the baron alive so that the computer can't effectively attack me as I have 50 smaller guys munching up his territory.

HOWEVER. It appears that the AI can, on a whim, decide it doesn't want the baron any more. I'm almost certain it doesn't run out of territory and die: I never see a cross to show it's died. It's just not there all of a sudden on the next turn. As far as I know, I can't perform this same feat of wishing away the expensive strength-sapper when I've got rid of whatever I don't want in my way: I'm stuck with him unless I can manage to have him stranded somewhere.

Could it be that I'm somehow just missing something? Right now the computer just had its turn and there is no baron any more and no cross for a dead baron either.

amateur · Post by **amateur** » Wed Mar 31, 2010 1:08 pm

I've seen the situation where I cut off a baron and the hut spawns on his hexagon, vanishing him. I've also seen knights disappear without noticing whether it was due to a hut or not - everything moves around, after all.

edbrannin · Post by **edbrannin** » Fri Jun 11, 2010 1:57 am

I'm sure I've seen enemy Barons disappear without any starvation -- when when the enemy has one big territory that's not divided. I haven't noticed it on the lower levels, so maybe the AI is allowed to cheat a bit at Baron difficulty?

(Also, I only play on iPhone)

ben · Post by **ben** » Sun Jul 18, 2010 12:04 am

I have seen barons vanish also. It looks like the CPU knows how to retire men.. I would like that skill also..

Legacy · Post by **Legacy** » Sun Jul 18, 2010 1:43 pm

Never seen that happen, and I've played a LOT of games with AI. What does tend to happen sometimes, is a baron gets caught in a small bubble of a cut, and the AI loses it without losing many other men.

Post by **Sean OConnor** » Mon Jul 19, 2010 4:53 pm

When a territory gets cut in half the game needs to create a new village in the newly created territory. It tries to put it on an open space, but if none are available it tries on a grave, then a tree, then a castle and then finally on a man. It also tries to put it in a central position in the territory.

Are you using a version before 5.0? The algorithm was slightly different then (it tried to put new villages in the furthest top left open position)

There's no (intentional) code for the computer to try and lose one of it's Barons though!

yogshog · Post by **yogshog** » Fri Sep 24, 2010 10:26 pm

As someone who has written programs and had people complain about problems that literally could not happen, I hesitate to say this. However, (unless I missed something big) in the game I just lost (on the version for the ipad) the AI had 2 barons in the same territory and I didn't cut his territory at all, but the next turn (with me almost eliminated) he only had one baron.

Also, it doesn't say in the rules anywhere - when territories are joined, is there any heuristic for figuring out ahead of time which HQ will be kept?

the space predator · Post by **the space predator** » Sat Sep 25, 2010 8:47 pm

yogshog wrote:As someone who has written programs and had people complain about problems that literally could not happen, I hesitate to say this. However, (unless I missed something big) in the game I just lost (on the version for the ipad) the AI had 2 barons in the same territory and I didn't cut his territory at all, but the next turn (with me almost eliminated) he only had one baron.

strange, I don't know how to explain it

maybe another AI player have cut is territory?

yogshog wrote: Also, it doesn't say in the rules anywhere - when territories are joined, is there any heuristic for figuring out ahead of time which HQ will be kept?

I think that it's the Hq of the largest territory

Legacy · Post by **Legacy** » Fri Oct 01, 2010 7:27 pm

It's the HQ with the largest territory, or the most income(not necessarily the same), not sure which.

Fusion_power · Post by **Fusion_power** » Tue Oct 05, 2010 7:19 am

largest territory retains the capital.

DarJones

Re-Peat · Post by **Re-Peat** » Sat Oct 09, 2010 9:08 pm

I've definitely witnessed the AI erasing Barons/Knights.

I've tried to figure out what creates that scenario but have found none. It's definitely not just a territory being split and having a hut spawn on a unit, it often happens when there is no split.

If you want a way to test it I have a method you could try. Play a map with a bottleneck that can be guarded by one baron, and situate yourself so you have half of the map (that can support the baron, of course) and the computer cannot advance.

This should create a stalemate (assuming the AI has resources for guarding barons as well) but it often doesn't... I bide my time and click End Turn, and the AI often reshuffles its forces a little. Sometimes (but not always) in this scenario it just disbands the baron which allows my own baron to storm through.

Spacehulk · Post by **Spacehulk** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 9:20 pm

Re-Peat wrote:I've definitely witnessed the AI erasing Barons/Knights.

Ditto.

I have seen this dozens of times (iPhone version). It has happened where the computer's territory has not been comprimised in any way. The computer's Baron is simply gone. In the case I am describing the barons do not starve. As all other units are still alive. No intervening other computer player captured any territory either.

I can not think of any other game function that could allow this to happen. It seems like a bug to me.

Gaspode · Post by **Gaspode** » Mon Mar 21, 2011 4:19 pm

I can "bank" all players except the baron. But I have seen incidents where the PC has not been starved but the baron has been removed from play.
I have also seen a number of "can't happen" situations where from the first move a warrior has appeared from a 4 hexagon island and done one further move before being starved. Something which I have been unable to myself. I suspect this is a bug, but such things as Barons being removed from play do seem to happen.

Fusion_power · Post by **Fusion_power** » Tue Mar 22, 2011 7:35 am

One of those weird strategy effects in Slay is that the AI will sometimes deliberately put a man in a position to starve with the apparent intent of forcing trees to multiply in an opponent's territory. This behavior is part of the base program for the game.

DarJones

Ber · Post by **Ber** » Tue Mar 22, 2011 10:28 pm

I have observed the same thing as Re-Peat and panicboy, except it my case it was with a knight.

It was on iPhone version, map Ette (5th row, 2nd column), hard. There is a narrow single hex wide, two hex long bridge between the central/left island and the right peninsulas. I had control of the entire main island, and light brown had control of the right peninsula. The AI offered to surrender one turn before I had completely dominated my area. I declined, so brown brought their knight up to the right side of the narrow bridge. In my next turn I finished taking the mainland then moved my knight to my side of the bridge, toe-to-toe with their knight.

On their next turn, their knight simply disappeared. There were no trees, the computer had one territory, other men did not disappear, there was no tombstones, and their territory had not shrunk a single hex in the last turn.

On the plus side it broke the stalemate before I even had to get a baron, but it sure looks like a bug to me!

Sean - I hope I have provided enough detail for it to be reproducible for you!

Sean O'Connor's Games

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